Great Society

Ningen Manga Productions => Women's Studies => Topic started by: RottingCorpse on February 21, 2006, 08:26:26 PM

Title: Poster, Teaser Trailer & Production Diaries
Post by: RottingCorpse on February 21, 2006, 08:26:26 PM
On my last film, First Session, we started marketing the film AFTER we made it, which I'm going to tell any aspiring filmmakers is the totally wrong way to do it.
The reason? Buzz is half of what we buy when we purchase a movie ticket or DVD. I want to add that this doesn't excuse sloppy or lazy filmmaking. But let's face it, what did we really pay for when we saw The Blair Witch Project?

With Women's Studies, marketing is in the forefront. This week, I'm hoping to reveal the totally kick-ass poster we've designed. Next month we're going to shoot a teaser trailer that's pretty damned exciting too.

Right now though, we're working on our website which we hope to be really fun and interactive. One big thing we're adding is video production diaries, not too different from the ones you may have seen on http://www.kongisking.net  (http://www.kongisking.net) and http://www.bluetights.net  (http://www.bluetights.net) for King Kong and Superman Returns respectively. (Though we will not rip them down and package them as DVDs to be bought as Universal did with the Kong diaries.)

We've got our own ideas for things we'll do, but I'm open to suggestions as well. Something you want to see us cover? Let us know here.
Title: Re: Poster, Teaser Trailer & Production Diaries
Post by: nacho on February 21, 2006, 08:29:58 PM
Time to get FS up for download/viewing!
Title: Re: Poster, Teaser Trailer & Production Diaries
Post by: RottingCorpse on February 21, 2006, 08:30:22 PM
That's being worked on.
Title: Re: Poster, Teaser Trailer & Production Diaries
Post by: RottingCorpse on March 02, 2006, 10:47:40 PM
This is the Women's Studies poster design. I'd love to hear people's thoughts, feedback, etc. The big questions you should ask yourself are a) "Does this image make me want to watch this film?" and b) "Is it an image that "grabs" me? Does it pique my curiosity?" The first image would be for big one-sheets, smaller posters, and print ads.

http://www.ningenmanga.com/old/wsposterfinal.jpg

Here's the image cropped for a DVD cover.

http://www.ningenmanga.com/old/wspostercrop.jpg
Title: Re: Poster, Teaser Trailer & Production Diaries
Post by: Goblin_Queen on March 03, 2006, 10:58:14 AM
It makes me wonder what this movie is about.  Did I miss the thread where you tell us what the movie is about?  Hey, is that a butcher knife?
Title: Re: Poster, Teaser Trailer & Production Diaries
Post by: nacho on March 03, 2006, 10:59:33 AM
More tits.  (Not bigger, I know who that is and don't let her hit me), but more revealing.  Peel back that top a little bit more so we can get a full tit hit.  I also suggest a longer necklace, and more obvious.  Is that the female sign she has?  Get that to be more clear and have it down just above and between her breasts so we're drawn to the tits instead of the shiny thing around her neck.  The whole point of tits is eye catching -- so use them!  Shiny things are also a distraction.  Because the tits are covered, and it's all the way up there, I spent more time trying to figure out what it was (looked like a cross at first glance).


The knife looks odd, too.  Less steak knife, more hunting knife.  And holding a place in the book doesn't quite work for me.  I don't know what's better, though...
Title: Re: Poster, Teaser Trailer & Production Diaries
Post by: nacho on March 03, 2006, 11:01:04 AM
It makes me wonder what this movie is about. Did I miss the thread where you tell us what the movie is about? Hey, is that a butcher knife?

http://www.greatsociety.org/forums/index.php?topic=1033.0
Title: Re: Poster, Teaser Trailer & Production Diaries
Post by: fajwat on March 03, 2006, 02:09:16 PM
for a full minute i thought the knife was a (leather) backpack strap, because it's small, the colors blend in, and the rest of the photo doesn't make me expect a knife.  The knife is just suspended somehow?  Horrific, systematic slaughter with a pristine kitchen knife?

The tits are great but Nacho's right -- the modesty is dismayingly respectful.  I realize you have your reasons (I recognize her), but this is a horror film set against rabidly PC college femenism, and that particular cleavage could be drooled over 3x as long for each half inch you reveal.  If you don't reveal a little more, I think the viewer will be questioning your motives. 
Title: Re: Poster, Teaser Trailer & Production Diaries
Post by: nacho on March 03, 2006, 02:19:18 PM
Here -- a great example of blending a necklace with tits.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1401302009
Title: Re: Poster, Teaser Trailer & Production Diaries
Post by: RottingCorpse on March 03, 2006, 03:30:53 PM
The tits are great but Nacho's right -- the modesty is dismayingly respectful.  

If you don't reveal a little more, I think the viewer will be questioning your motives. 

Explain what you mean a little more.

On more tits: Part of the reason it's less revealing is the angle the photographer took the shot at. Full on front, there's was much more cleavage and bosom. Also, I feel that there's just enough tits to be a tease, Like catching a glance of the tits of the hot chick you work with when she stands just the right way and her shirt opens a bit.

Plus, the main focus of the image isn't supposed to be the tits. It's the logo on the book cover. I understand that the tits are supposed to draw you in, but remember that the only bright colored things in the image are the woman's skin and the book cover. Kay, and the necklace, but that's against the skin. Everything else is dark contrast to draw attention to the title.

We actually discussed the necklace quite a bit and I felt like you do, that it should be clearer so people could see what it is. (It's an ankh.) However, the photographer convinced me that it's really a secondary element and that if people are taking the time to figure out what it is, they've already registered the important elements.

I guess a better question is what was the first thing your eyes went to? The necklace? The book cover? The tits?

The knife. I originally wanted her to be holding the knife, but it looked really awkward so we went with the bookmark idea which is only less awkward.

I lactually like the cropped version better, even for a big poster. What do you think?
Title: Re: Poster, Teaser Trailer & Production Diaries
Post by: nacho on March 03, 2006, 04:00:22 PM
What my eyes went to:  The necklace, the tits, the awkward knife, the title.

You can't have tits of any sort in a poster and say it's not about the tits, especially in horror.  Of course it is.  Didn't we talk about this in an old convo about the Sleepaway camp 3 poster? 

Also, jewelry of any sort will draw the eye.  That's why we wear it.  So if it's going to be there, it needs to accentuate the tits.  (Look at the placement of the blood on that Sleepaway Camp poster).  The photographer is a drunk! 

Both versions have merit.  I actually lean towards the big one, though.  Lips and hair and her hidden smile.
Title: Re: Poster, Teaser Trailer & Production Diaries
Post by: RottingCorpse on March 03, 2006, 04:20:06 PM
Yes, the tits are important, but their job is to lead you to the title. I don't want people to remember tits, I want them to remember "Women's Studies."

Also, I want it to be an eye-grabber when up against other posters/DVD covers. When we went to the Temecula Film Festival, our poster for First Session seemed to get lost among the others, even though it's a friggin' awesome poster. There was nothing to make it stand out. We're trying to make this one "pop" a little more, hence the contrast of light and dark.

My biggest concern is the knife. The bookmark idea seemed to be a good one at the time, but like I said, it was secondary to the woman HOLDING the knife. The problem was that we couldn't just jettison the knife when we saw how unnatural holding the book and the knife was. (Without the knife, it's just a hot chick holding a bloody book.) Like you Nacho, I'm not sure how else to do it. I'm trying to walk a line between subtle and over-the-top, and unfortunately, that's a wide expanse of gray area.

In the final "yea or nea" though, does this image work? I think it does, but I'd rather know I'm wrong now than later.
Title: Re: Poster, Teaser Trailer & Production Diaries
Post by: nacho on March 03, 2006, 04:51:02 PM
Your concern is valid.  The knife is a problem.
Title: Re: Poster, Teaser Trailer & Production Diaries
Post by: Goblin_Queen on March 03, 2006, 04:54:57 PM
You could always stick the knife between the tits like the Ren Fair women do.
Title: Re: Poster, Teaser Trailer & Production Diaries
Post by: nacho on March 03, 2006, 05:00:36 PM
You could always stick the knife between the tits like the Ren Fair women do.

Oh, god, I love that.  There was this redhead to die for last year...man.

So I've been sitting here staring at your poster, partially amused that everybody recognizes the model based on her tits, and I'm wondering if you may be underestimating the book design.  Do you even need the knife?  The book sort of speaks for itself.  It's spiky, dripping blood... It's not "just a hot chick holding a book."  In fact, the more vague it is, the better.  Don't give them too much.
Title: Re: Poster, Teaser Trailer & Production Diaries
Post by: RottingCorpse on March 03, 2006, 05:11:22 PM
We didn't shoot a picture without the knife, so we'd have to do it again.

The book cover is awesome (designed by Tyson Tate) and really does zing. I had toyed with the idea of having some blood splatter on the tits instead of using the knife, but it fell through. Your general horror fan likes the over-the-top, so in that sense, the knife in it's cheesy awkwardness works. (Am I justifying? A little bit.)

Also, Mrs. RC thinks that the body pose is awkward too. We have a shot with a different pose that we're trying to get emailed to us. I'll post it when I have it. It hasn't been photoshopped and retouched, but it'll give you the basic idea. The bookmark knife will still be there though.
Title: Re: Poster, Teaser Trailer & Production Diaries
Post by: nacho on March 03, 2006, 05:16:43 PM
We've not made your Friday, have we?
Title: Re: Poster, Teaser Trailer & Production Diaries
Post by: RottingCorpse on March 03, 2006, 05:22:24 PM
Actually, it's good to test run these things and see how people react, especially when I'm on the fence myself. Ultimately, it has to be the best image to sell the movie to audiences. (And the concept to investors.)

Am I trying to avoid a reshoot? Of course.  But if I have to justify to myself (or to you guys) that the image works, then it probably doesn't.
Title: Re: Poster, Teaser Trailer & Production Diaries
Post by: nacho on March 03, 2006, 05:28:49 PM
Reshoot is doubly hard because the hair's gone, right?  I think long hair is a primary part of the look.
Title: Re: Poster, Teaser Trailer & Production Diaries
Post by: RottingCorpse on March 03, 2006, 05:34:55 PM
That's a wig. Nice, eh?
Title: Re: Poster, Teaser Trailer & Production Diaries
Post by: nacho on March 03, 2006, 05:37:08 PM
That's very nice.  It matches how she looked with long hair.  Terrific.  Well, then, I lean towards reshoot.  Get her a man's knife, if you must have one.  A longer necklace, a little bit more breast.

I'm forgetting -- was the ankh in the script?  You want the woman symbol, don't you?
Title: Re: Poster, Teaser Trailer & Production Diaries
Post by: RottingCorpse on March 03, 2006, 05:41:39 PM
No, the ankh wasn't in the script, but people often use them interchangeably with Venus/female symbols, even though the original Egyptian ankhs are actually though to be fertility glyphs.

Title: Re: Poster, Teaser Trailer & Production Diaries
Post by: nacho on March 03, 2006, 05:44:29 PM
Well, since the book cover has the Venus symbol, and it's a heavy feature in the story, then shouldn't your model be wearing it?  It seems odd if she's wearing another symbol, no matter how related it may be.
Title: Re: Poster, Teaser Trailer & Production Diaries
Post by: RottingCorpse on March 03, 2006, 05:51:58 PM
I think we're overanalyzing it, but an ankh is pretty much a female symbol without a round circle.

Plus, we're not set on using the Venus symbol as THE female symbol as stated in the script. I haven't done the research yet, but we're going to look into other symbols and images . . . try to make it a bit more subtle.

But you're right. Maybe we should make some of those design decisions before we start designing ad campaigns.

Still, the idea with the poster is just to have a teaser image of some sort to start getting out in the ether so people go, "What's this about? When does it come out?" Besides, if by the grace of god, we get picked up for distribution, the distributor will bring in their own marketing team and do it how they want.
Title: Re: Poster, Teaser Trailer & Production Diaries
Post by: fajwat on March 03, 2006, 07:56:24 PM
The tits are great but Nacho's right -- the modesty is dismayingly respectful.   

If you don't reveal a little more, I think the viewer will be questioning your motives. 

Explain what you mean a little more.
...
I actually like the cropped version better, even for a big poster. What do you think?

I liked the cropped better too.

Just having a horror film named "Women's Studies" seems to raise many possible angles.  The fact that she could be on her way to a business meeting or grad dissertation, for me, overwhealms the playfulness of the concept.  (Nacho's "book speaks for itself" might be true if the image weren't so indistinguishably dark on my monitor.)  I'm not saying exploit her, I'm saying this pic seems to scream, "NO!  I respect women!  She's neither wicked nor naughty, how dare you think that?"  Which leads to either, "I don't know why they went mad and killed everyone!" or "They were justifiably provoked!" or..?  I'm left wondering the angle, your motive.

And all this is without being able to see the book clearly, so I'm just explaining that reaction.  I guess both of my monitors are too dark.  Without the playfulness of the book's design, the pic's primness (hands clasped, business attire minus a button) seemed to shut down more questions than it raised.  Actually, staring at it and wildly readjusting my monitor has brought me to appreciate the composition more -- but that's my explanation of my first reaction. 
Title: Re: Poster, Teaser Trailer & Production Diaries
Post by: RottingCorpse on March 03, 2006, 10:02:58 PM
Those are interesting comments, fajwat. I'm about to leave, so I'll go deeper into it later.

I was going more for the "good girl gone bad" idea.
Title: Re: Poster, Teaser Trailer & Production Diaries
Post by: fajwat on March 04, 2006, 10:12:41 AM
ok, back on my home monitor I changed the gamma from 0.95 to 2.0 and the pic makes a lot more sense.  To give an idea of the detail I was missing, below 1.5 I can't see that her skirt is plaid.  I've been getting "good girl gone bad" since just before my last comment, and this view solidifies it. 
Title: Re: Poster, Teaser Trailer & Production Diaries
Post by: RottingCorpse on March 04, 2006, 12:09:13 PM
Nice.

Again, the knife is the big weak spot. Just about everyone I've shown it to has said it looks "weird," "strange," or "awkward."

I'll stay with the cropped version for the pre-production promotion then reshoot later once we're working iwth a real budget.

Thanks for the feedback guys.

(And don't worry, fajwat. I'll come back soon and pontificate on my motives as a filmmaker with this script.)
Title: Re: Poster, Teaser Trailer & Production Diaries
Post by: fajwat on March 04, 2006, 12:37:04 PM
OK.. can we still see the other pose, if just for funzies?  We all like funzies, right?

Just to be clear, I wasn't really questioning your motives so much as I was saying that this photo raises the queasy possibility that this is actually about women's studies, with incidental knives.  Though I'd love to hear them, yes please.  =)
Title: Re: Poster, Teaser Trailer & Production Diaries
Post by: RottingCorpse on April 02, 2006, 04:13:23 PM
I need font suggestions for the poster.

We've got a rough layout, but the fonts not working for us, so if anybody has any suggestions, I'm open.
Title: Re: Poster, Teaser Trailer & Production Diaries
Post by: Tatertots on April 02, 2006, 05:47:02 PM
Font for what? The copy? The title? Give me a text sample and I can give you a fat swatch of samples.

I've got eleventy-billion fonts and the clap!