Children of the Sun > Newsday

Brexit: Victory for Pub Racists and Soccer Hooligans

<< < (2/10) > >>

nacho:
And getting back in is difficult.

The older generation has always been uncomfortable with the EU. The only surprising aspect is that they successfully swayed the vote. That means that the youngsters didn't turn out in the numbers they should have...in which case, it's more accurate to say that the younger generation has fucked themselves.

Per your text -- I think the planning and timing is perfect. Scotland's referendum will be crippled by low oil prices. They'll only vote out if they're riding high on that wave...and that's their only wave. NI won't be able to swallow the Papists (as Monkey says). The gamble here is to destabilize the Euro, which will tempt the other weak links to leave the EU. And then that's that.

These UKIP fascists don't particularly care if they lose Scotland anyway. Small price to pay for nationalism.

RottingCorpse:
Man, long term the implications are fearful. Germany & France's economies will stand up (hopefully), but  places like Greece who lied their way into the EU and then had huge buyer's remorse? The Nazi nationalists there will use Britain's exit to fuel their own even though living on the drachma isn't going to do them any better. Then you have countries like Poland who basically need the Euro to prop up their economy. They'll falter, badly.

Putin is watching all this, warming up the tanks, and wondering how soon to start moving west.

nacho:
Part of me feels like this was inevitable, though. And even though we see that grey-haired vote, the feelings are there for the younger generation as well. Anger at what the EU has done to the UK seeps into even the most banal modern Britcoms.

It's been a convenience for the UK...but nothing more than that.

I think maybe this thread does belong in the "Greece: Fucking Things Up" thread, because that's the straw that broke the EU's back. Greece hanged a lampshade on the idea that the EU is composed of the haves who are supporting the have nots in what amounts to an artificial system. It only works if everyone says it works. For years now, people have stopped saying that it works. We've seen the ruptures in Ireland, Spain, Italy, the eastern countries, and then the fire finally took hold in Greece.

As for Putin -- his tanks still have NATO to worry about. The larger concern here is our policy of appeasement (the Ukraine) and what'll happen when these poor Eastern countries, some of which have never known true democracy outside of the last generation, are cut loose.   

RottingCorpse:
What baffles me is that I'm trying to see how ultimately this EU separatism could be a positive move for the UK, and I come up with very little. Sure the Pound doesn't have to be linked with the fortunes of the Euro. (And today's giant drop isn't likely permanent.) However, the market will remain volatile for five years or more as the dust settles. As we note in the Greece situation, the EU is just a nebulous concept on some level. But it does actually have real world economic implications.

The fact that Northern Ireland and Scotland universally were opposed to EY separatism speaks leagues about the political troubles ahead, specifically in terms of North Irish home rule. It's 1910 all over again!

Other then "keeping the brown people out," what's really gained here? It seems lose-lose to me, but maybe I'm missing something.

nacho:
British nationalism is nothing new. The EU's restrictions range from everything from work hours to fishing laws. There's a general sense of "faraway unelected officials dictating terms" that haunts a former Empire's nights.

I think Trump and the media are making the immigration spin. Yes, that's one of the issues. But even that issue is complicated. The heart of it isn't keeping the brown people out, it's that the brown people (or eastern Europeans, rather) only want to go there. Because why wouldn't they? Even in the EU, the UK is a thriving and strong economy. So the burden isn't being spread equally on many levels. Why should a handful accept the responsibility for the many? The EU almost comes off as a philanthropic organization more than anything from certain viewpoints.

It's a mistake, though. Don't get me wrong.

Navigation

[0] Message Index

[#] Next page

[*] Previous page

Go to full version