Author Topic: Scottish Independence  (Read 8889 times)

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Offline nacho

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Scottish Independence
« on: October 15, 2012, 02:41:56 PM »
Well, this has been long talked about...so here we go. Countdown to a free Scotland in 2014! We can all deep-fry a few Mars bars in solidarity.


Quote
Britain, Scotland sign deal to allow independence vote

By Anthony Faiola, Updated: Monday, October 15, 10:13 AM

LONDON – Britain and Scotland signed an accord Monday paving the way for a historic vote for independence that could see this island’s northern lands stand alone for the first time in three centuries as Europe’s newest sovereign state.

Monday’s accord effectively launches a critical two-year independence campaign during which the Scottish National Party — whose surprise victory in regional elections last year laid the path for a referendum — will go toe-to-toe against those fiercely opposed to rupturing modern Britain.

The deal agreeing on the terms of a Scottish referendum, to be held by fall 2014, comes at a time when independence movements are also rapidly gaining strength in Spain and Belgium amid Europe’s brutal debt crisis. But the vote on independence for Scotland sets up the possibility that Washington’s closest strategic ally could be torn asunder.

“This marks the beginning of an important chapter in Scotland's story and allows the real debate to begin,” British Prime Minister David Cameron said after signing the deal with Scotland’s First Minister Alex Salmond, the National Party leader. “It paves the way so that the biggest question of all can be settled: a separate Scotland or a United Kingdom? I will be making a very positive argument for our United Kingdom.”

After centuries of bloody battles with the English, Scotland signed away its sovereignty in the early 1700s. By the late 1990s, however, it had won the right to a “devolved” Parliament, and it now has sweeping powers over its judicial system and public spending.

Full independence would give the the ruling National Party the authority to fulfill a host of pledges, including the expulsion of the British nuclear fleet from Scottish waters, withdrawing from NATO and the removal of Scottish regiments from Britain’s military forces overseas. It would also give politicians in Edinburgh the freedom to vote separately from — and perhaps counter to — Britain in world bodies such as the United Nations and the International Monetary Fund.

Importantly, the deal signed Monday means the Scots will be able to stage their 2014 referendum amid the emotional 700th anniversary of the Battle of Bannockburn, in which Robert the Bruce led Scottish troops to victory over the English invaders.

Recent polls have shown Scottish support for independence — which has hovered around a third to a quarter of the population — waning a bit since late last year. A solid majority of 55 percent are opposed to breaking away. But Salmond remains wildly popular in Scotland, and analysts say it would be wrong to discount his ability to mobilize a successful “yes” vote.

“At the moment, it appears a yes vote will be difficult, but you would be unwise to bet against Alex Salmond,” said Ben Page, chief executive of the London-based Ipsos MORI polling firm. “He will be thinking about the symbolism of the anniversary of the Battle of Bannockburn, and looking to a Scottish generation that came of age with [the movie] ‘Braveheart.’ ”

A move toward independence would also lock Edinburgh and London in fierce negotiations over the cash cow that is North Sea oil — control of which is seen as essential to National Party dreams of Scotland emerging as a wealthy and progressive nation, mirroring energy-rich Norway. Independence for Scotland could rob the British state of a massive source of revenue, draining the coffers of a nation undergoing painful waves of austerity to cut its deficit and bring down the national debt.

Salmond on Monday vowed to run a “positive” campaign focused on arguing that Scotland would be “economically and socially” better off alone.

“The Scottish Government has an ambitious vision for Scotland as a prosperous and successful European country . . . a Scotland with a new place in the world, as an independent nation,” Salmond said.

Sensing the force of Tartan pride, Cameron and the “no” campaign appear set to focus not on the economic question but on the other reasons for Scots to remain in the union, including the weight of history and the outsize influence Britain as a whole enjoys on the world stage.

Cameron, a Conservative, said he would “passionately” campaign to keep Scotland in the union, despite the fact that the opposition Labor Party — which has a strong following in Scotland — would stand to lose the most from independence and would find it much harder to win enough support to return to power in a smaller United Kingdom.

Regardless of the outcome of the referendum, Salmond’s party has promised to keep the British monarch as Scotland’s head of state, mirroring decisions by Australia, Canada and other Commonwealth nations.

Monday’s agreement amounted to a compromise. To win legal recognition of the vote from the British Parliament, Salmond gave up his insistence that the vote contain a second question asking Scots if they wanted even more autonomy from Britain as an alternative to independence.

But Cameron also conceded several major points. He had called for a speedier timetable and for holding the referendum before 2014, given that experts say the current double-dip recession may actually spook Scots into voting to stay within the union, which also includes England, Wales and Northern Ireland.

In addition, Cameron bowed to Salmond’s calls to allow 16- and 17-year-olds to vote in the referendum, with the agreement recognizing the power of the Scottish Parliament to decide the question. Although polling has been somewhat inconclusive on their preferences, there is a perception in Scotland that younger voters who grew up with a devolved Scottish regional parliament would be more willing to support independence. Although the agreement applies only to the independence referendum, the concession appeared set to touch off a broader campaign to lower the voting age for a host of national and local elections.

“It would have been unfair to have a vote on the future of Scotland in which the future of Scotland could not take part,” said David Linden, 22, head of the Young Scots for Independence. “We’ve grown up in a Scotland with its own parliament and don’t want to see any Scottish laws made by a parliament in London. We are ready to take the next step.”


© The Washington Post Company

Offline monkey!

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Re: Scottish Independence
« Reply #1 on: October 16, 2012, 08:14:20 PM »
Ha! Scotland will be bankrupt in 10 years.
There will come a day for every man when he will relish the prospect of eating his own shit. That day has yet to come for me.

Offline nacho

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Re: Scottish Independence
« Reply #2 on: October 17, 2012, 07:17:46 AM »
They have oil. They'll be a Chavez-ian state in 10 years! Except, hopefully, run by someone like Malcolm Tucker.

Offline monkey!

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Re: Scottish Independence
« Reply #3 on: October 18, 2012, 12:19:58 AM »
They'll crown Sean Connery as King.
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Offline nacho

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Re: Scottish Independence
« Reply #4 on: October 18, 2012, 12:22:05 AM »
There's probably a group eager to do so...

Offline monkey!

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Re: Scottish Independence
« Reply #5 on: October 18, 2012, 12:25:55 AM »
I'd vote for him.
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Offline nacho

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Re: Scottish Independence
« Reply #6 on: January 07, 2014, 01:36:55 PM »
LOL...

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/jan/07/scots-independence-union-english-better-together

Quote
When The Only Way Is Essex star Mark Wright was paid £7,000 to flick the switch for cash-strapped Perth council's Christmas lights many felt that celebrity dominance had entered some newly awful dark age. But things have just taken a dramatic turn for the worse.

As the Tory-funded and Labour-fronted campaign against Scottish independence begins to panic, David Cameron has suggested that a battle for hearts and minds is needed to persuade us recalcitrant Scots to stick with the Good Ship Britannia.

His outburst came after unfortunate reports that senior Tories believed Alistair Darling's leadership of the no campaign was "comatose" and "useless". So how to give Darling a shake? How to win us over? The answer, apparently, is comedian Eddie Izzard, along with a whole fleet of red-carpet English entertainers, who are to be driven north to bring shine and glee to the rather dreary Project Fear. It's a shrewd move. What could possibly go wrong?

The identities of the English celebrities "have yet to be revealed", the Herald teases – so fevered speculation has ensued. In an act of cross-border cultural solidarity, let us throw some names into the hat.

Besides Izzard, this gang needs a frontperson and who better than Katie Hopkins, who's outspoken and personable? David "cheap as chips" Dickinson could surely hold the economics brief – we know it's all about the economy so who better to plug the value of UK plc? And David Mitchell could explain to people why their culture is worthless.

Brian May could bring his axe to the party, with another moving rock reinterpretation of our humble anthem. And surely after their resurrection for Olympic gold the Spice Girls could come and tell us what we really, really want? For some eye-candy for the older ladies who better than the portly but twinkly-eyed Paul Hollywood? A Great Briton if ever there was one. After all who wants democracy when you could have the perfect rum baba?

Remember, this isn't just another celebrity lark – it's not I'm a Celebrity or Celebrity Big Brother – the challenge is to save the freakin' union! So we need to have all the bases covered.

We are Better Together, right? Therefore we need a happy couple to lead this red, white and blue band of brothers. A few years ago nobody could have seen past Richard Madeley and Judy Finnigan. But these days nobody gives you the feeling that everything's all right in the world more than Kirstie Allsop and Phil Spencer. They are the perfect answer to all those nasty Nats – who wants to run your own country when you could be creating a distressed look with a table cluster or relocating to the Cotswolds?

With Frankie Boyle, Biffy Clyro, Eddi Reader, Midge Ure, Hardeep Singh Kohli, Annie Lennox, Kevin Bridges, Mark Millar, Mogwai, Alan Cummings, Elaine C Smith, Brian Cox, Irvine Welsh and a raft of others backing independence, there seems to be celebrity Scots queuing round the block for the yes vote – and just Lorraine Kelly and Sharleen Spiteri for no. While the notion that such a decision should be influenced by celebrities is laughable, the idea that the no campaign could bypass Scottish C-list celebrities for English stand-ins is such a demeaning cultural cringe it is awe-inspiring.

Offline monkey!

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Re: Scottish Independence
« Reply #7 on: January 07, 2014, 03:30:22 PM »
Scottish independence would be, in the long term, counterproductive for Scotland itself, once they realize those private oil companies won't pay them the taxes they need to sustain independence.
There will come a day for every man when he will relish the prospect of eating his own shit. That day has yet to come for me.

Offline nacho

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Re: Scottish Independence
« Reply #8 on: January 07, 2014, 03:36:11 PM »
Big plans to fall back on those haggis exports are in the works...

Offline monkey!

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Re: Scottish Independence
« Reply #9 on: January 08, 2014, 05:12:15 AM »
Big plans to fall back on those haggis exports are in the works...

They're hard to catch those Haggis.
There will come a day for every man when he will relish the prospect of eating his own shit. That day has yet to come for me.

Offline nacho

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Re: Scottish Independence
« Reply #10 on: January 08, 2014, 08:22:56 AM »
Big plans to fall back on those haggis exports are in the works...

They're hard to catch those Haggis.

You have to crouch in the hedgerow and make honking noises.

Offline monkey!

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Re: Scottish Independence
« Reply #11 on: January 08, 2014, 10:29:58 AM »
Big plans to fall back on those haggis exports are in the works...

They're hard to catch those Haggis.

You have to crouch in the hedgerow and make honking noises.

One must serenade them with bagpipes.
There will come a day for every man when he will relish the prospect of eating his own shit. That day has yet to come for me.

Offline RottingCorpse

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Re: Scottish Independence
« Reply #12 on: January 08, 2014, 11:56:21 AM »

Offline nacho

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Re: Scottish Independence
« Reply #13 on: August 27, 2014, 12:33:10 PM »
September 18th is around the corner. A simple majority is all they need, at which time "independence talks will begin," according to the government. Which can only mean....



....a drone invasion!

Offline RottingCorpse

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Re: Scottish Independence
« Reply #14 on: August 27, 2014, 12:34:21 PM »
First Doctor Who then THE WORLD!!!!!