Author Topic: Obama Care...now with mint flavoring!  (Read 16279 times)

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Offline Sirharles

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Obama Care...now with mint flavoring!
« on: July 28, 2009, 05:03:02 PM »
I didn't see any posts about Obama's health care plan, maybe I missed them.  But I thought this was an interesting article about freedoms we could lose should his plan pass.

http://finance.yahoo.com/insurance/article/107408/5-freedoms-you-would-lose-in-health-care-reform.html?mod=insurance-health

Offline Reginald McGraw

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Re: Obama Care...now with mint flavoring!
« Reply #1 on: July 28, 2009, 05:51:48 PM »
Yes, when the government decides to control something, you can be assured loss of freedom.

Offline nacho

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Re: Obama Care...now with mint flavoring!
« Reply #2 on: July 28, 2009, 06:04:03 PM »
Those loss of freedoms describe the Kaiser health plan!

Offline Reginald McGraw

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Re: Obama Care...now with mint flavoring!
« Reply #3 on: July 28, 2009, 06:06:01 PM »
As a Kaiser member, I agree with you.

Offline Tatertots

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Re: Obama Care...now with mint flavoring!
« Reply #4 on: July 28, 2009, 06:32:41 PM »
Yes, when the government decides to control something, you can be assured loss of freedom.

I dunno, man. Whatever freedoms I lose with socialized firefighters, I'm fine with. Thank god we don't have privatized firefighters because that would be a fucking nightmare. Kind of like, you know, the healthcare system.

On the other hand, the idea of me being healthy and smart about the risks I take while the 60% of the idiot country that's morbidly obese rack up insane bills on my tab is not fun. At all.

Actually, that's what I'm looking for in a health insurance plan: I want to save money because I'm wildly healthy and haven't been sick in several years but I want to account for the fact that maybe I'll get hit by a bus or get cancer someday. I'll take suggestions if you have them.

Otherwise, I can't make heads or tails of the healthcare system.
« Last Edit: July 28, 2009, 06:35:55 PM by Tatertots »

Offline Reginald McGraw

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Re: Obama Care...now with mint flavoring!
« Reply #5 on: July 28, 2009, 06:48:22 PM »
Firefighters are under the jurisdiction (thank goodness) of local government, not a federalized one-size fits all policy.  I don't know how screwed up the health care system is today, but I do know that large federal programs tend to suck and/or fail.

But yes, what you're asking for is available today, but maybe not under the Obama plan.

Get catastrophic insurance.  It covers expensive things.  Pay the rest out of pocket.

Offline Tatertots

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Re: Obama Care...now with mint flavoring!
« Reply #6 on: July 28, 2009, 07:55:59 PM »
I think my new employer has a deal where you get catastrophic up to $250,000 and then you put $100 into a health savings thing, which covers everything health related. Office visits and such, I think.

Which reminds me, for the first time in 5 years, I can finally buy a new hearing aid. Because, Jesus, the thing I have right now is closer to an ear horn than a modern hearing aid. I feel like a 90 year old, sometimes.

Offline nacho

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Re: Obama Care...now with mint flavoring!
« Reply #7 on: July 28, 2009, 09:07:42 PM »
Actually, Tyson hits a nerve with the obese thing... This country is third world when it comes to health consciousness.  I certainly don't want to hold up the massive legion of uneducated, smoking, sugar-swilling, Popeye's Chicken addicts.  It is about 60%, also.  60% of my co-workers are stuffing their faces with unhealthy shit...all day.  Constantly eating.  It sounds like a barnyard out there with the crunching and chewing.  You can't move anywhere in the office at any point in the day without seeing these huge crippled cows jamming mass plateloads of food down their throats.

And now I want chicken.

Offline Cassander

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Re: Obama Care...now with mint flavoring!
« Reply #8 on: July 28, 2009, 09:39:19 PM »
i do enjoy popeye's but i only go once every two months. 

really, though, if we do nothing, how much better do you think it will get?  health insurance today just sucks ass even if you've got a decent middle of the road job.  if you're working part time, then just forget it.  the points i definitely agree with about obama's plan are somehow lowering costs, expanding coverage, and using more specialized taxes (whether it's cigarettes, alcohol, people who have premium gold standard insurance, or people who make over a million) to provide either more preventative measures or to subsidize certain costs.  i'm not definitely sold on a government alternative, and i'm can't really side with taxing your benefits or businesses either.
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Offline RottingCorpse

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Re: Obama Care...now with mint flavoring!
« Reply #9 on: July 29, 2009, 12:41:04 AM »
Survival of the fittest . . .

And health care will always stay partially (and I think mostly) privatized. It's the American way.

Offline nacho

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Re: Obama Care...now with mint flavoring!
« Reply #10 on: July 29, 2009, 11:42:41 AM »
Speaking of the devil...

Quote
One of the most troubling nuggets to come out of the Centers for Disease Control's Weight of the Nation conference on obesity prevention is that childhood obesity is so severe that the next generation could be the first in more than 200 years to live shorter lives than their parents.

Offline Reginald McGraw

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Re: Obama Care...now with mint flavoring!
« Reply #11 on: July 29, 2009, 12:06:09 PM »
To fix health care costs, I think something should be done about litigation (not just a problem with health care, but...)

Yes, if something insane happens you should be able to sue.  However, the reason that health care is so expensive is the cost of malpractice insurance.  When it is no longer lucrative to be a doctor, the smart people will get out.  When you have huge debt (loans) coming out of medical school, fees for services are all negotiated to the lowest levels by health insurance groups, and you have to pay malpractice fees which rise substantially every year...it is no longer lucrative to be a doctor (unless you are a brilliant specialist).

When smart people stop being doctors, our level of care drops, and in some cases disappears.

If we address the out of hand litigation and malpractice costs, the current system has a chance of survival.  Left alone (or with the Obama plan) I don't think it provides decent health care to many, outside the rich.  Although with Obama, maybe the leveling of the playing field insures that no one gets decent health care.

Offline nacho

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Re: Obama Care...now with mint flavoring!
« Reply #12 on: July 29, 2009, 12:14:39 PM »
Right on, Reggie!  We always boil down to that...with our healthcare problems, our education shortfall... But it's not a catchy enough issue to address, I guess.

We're always going to be the provincial farmers.  No matter how urban we get, the dirt-eating simpleton is still in each of us.

Offline Tatertots

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Re: Obama Care...now with mint flavoring!
« Reply #13 on: July 29, 2009, 03:32:30 PM »
http://www.whitehouse.gov/health-insurance-consumer-protections/

Some of that sounds nice to me. Or are these whispered lies?

Offline Reginald McGraw

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Re: Obama Care...now with mint flavoring!
« Reply #14 on: July 29, 2009, 03:49:14 PM »
Sure, some of that does sound nice.  However, it doesn't address the important points brought up in the yahoo article above that refer to the actual legislation (of course, who knows what the final version will look like).

Take this point from the whitehouse.gov link:

# No Exorbitant Out-of-Pocket Expenses, Deductibles or Co-Pays
# Insurance companies will have to abide by yearly caps on how much they can charge for out-of-pocket expenses.

What is not discussed:  What if I WANT to choose a high deductible or co-pay to get a lower overall rate (think car insurance here)?  It's certainly not good business sense for the insurer to offer high co-pays if there is a cap on the dollar amount for co-pays (and seriously, are we now going to devote federal dollars to decide what this cap is every year?  Of course we are)  Now the insurance company will just not offer that benefit anymore, and that person pays more.

How about:
# No Gender Discrimination
# Insurance companies will be prohibited from charging you more because of your gender.

Okay, sounds great!  Unless you were the "cheaper" gender.  I guarantee that the insurance companies will not say "OH!! My bad!  Everyone pays the same LOWER rate.   Nope, they will say, "Okay, cool!  Our rates are based on what the different genders actually cost!  We'll be happy to raise the rate for the cheaper gender and take that as profit."

I don't have all the answers here, but I'm skeptical that anyone really does enough to provide a comprehensive overhaul.